Joe Roark's IronHistoryArchives.com
The HUGE library of Iron History compiled by Joe Roark.
Welcome to Iron History with Joe Roark!
Joe Roark has been studying the iron game since 1957, and by 1970 began a systematic gathering of information on index cards. By the time his first computer was acquired, there were several hundred thousand references to be typed into it.
For a few years he published his own newsletter called MuscleSearch: The Roark Report. By 1992 he was appointed as the IFBB Men's Bodybuilding Historian, and began writing about history for FLEX in his column Factoids. For ten years he contributed to Iron Game History from the U of Texas at Austin. Recently he also began writing All Our Yesterdays for FLEX.
His passion has always been the period between 1880 and 1920, with particular emphasis on the oldtime strongmen of that era. Joe will be offering bits of history for Cyberpump once per week, and the text will be relevant to the dates of the calendar for those events of yesteryear relevant to the coming week.
In this column, readers will also be able to ask Joe questions or comment on his posts. Note: The comments are solely for interaction between Joe and the readers only -- not reader to reader.
9/24/2004: Edgar Mueller Manuscript
Thursday, September 23, 2004
Edgar Mueller, perhaps best known for his book Goerner the Mighty, also wrote other materials, of course.
One such paper was 'The History of the Two Hands Jerk; Clean-, and Snatch-Lifting and apparatus used for its(sic) in Germany, Austria and France', which was completed January 4, 1950.
The paper is ten pages in the author's own handwriting- which may slow the reader down compared to typed text, but I trust you'll find, as did I that the effort is worth the knowledge gained.
Over the next few weeks we will be presenting two pages at a time of this manuscript. This may cause some awkward page breaks but will be easily resumed with the next installment. We may not present it in five consecutive installments- have not decided yet.
Here are pages one and two.
Page2:
Posted by TheEditor @ 08:36 PM CST
9/17/2004: Back Porch Backlift by Paul Anderson, by Joe Roark
Thursday, September 16, 2004
Back Porch Backlift by Paul Anderson, by Joe Roark
[Introductory word: Sometimes when reading a description, we tend to not fully interpret the nuances of what is being written. That is, we do not re-enact using lighter weights the situations we read about, or we do not even imagine re-enacting those lifts step by literal step as though we had been present, thus the reality of specific circumstances is not questioned. In the following scenario, please point out my errors of reasoning if you feel there are any] And, I may just have purposefully left an opening for you to do that�
As of about 1956, Paul Anderson became interested in the backlift after Jack Walsh challenged Paul on the Steve Allen TV show. Walsh had claimed to have bettered Cyr�s record. It was in that year or in 1957 that people began approaching Paul asking, if he was the strongest man in the world, why was he not listed in the Guinness Book of Superlatives for 1956, instead of this entry:
�The greatest weight ever raised by a human being is 4,133 lbs. (1.84 tons) by the 350 lb. French-Canadian, Luis Cyr (1863-1912) in Chicago in 1896 in a back-lift (weight raised off trestles).�
So, Paul began thinking about exceeding that lift, though he had never performed one at the time Walsh challenged him, and had not yet built a platform, and was not sure of the height from the ground such a platform needed to be. He wrote to Tom Ryan many years later, April 1, 1988, that he ��first had to determine just how high I wanted to lift the weight and in what position I would be. I noticed that the back porch of our home, which was not underpinned, looked about the right height. I proceeded to get under the porch and place my hands on a large tool chest that was there. The position felt exactly to my liking, and just for the fun of it, I started pushing. I found that this backlift stance was so sturdy that I continued to push and raised the entire porch from its foundation. I actually believe it was heavier than the official weight I eventually lifted.� Perhaps he had sat on the safe, only a few yards from the porch, as this idea hit him.
That final sentence of the above quote needs explanation. Remember Paul wrote to me that the total amount of the official backlift, listed as 6,270 lbs, was actually about 200 pounds more than that, or approximately 6,500 lbs. So Paul was stating to Tom Ryan that without a warm-up, on his first ever attempt at a backlift, in an impromptu situation, he believed he lifted more than 6,500 lbs. He once told his brother-in-law that he had managed 7,000 lbs but since no witnesses were present, Paul never made that claim public. Perhaps this back porch backlift was the occasion for the 7,000 lbs backlift?
Questions are not answers, but there are several important questions related to the back porch backlift which Paul left unanswered, and those who feel they have the answers, please feel welcome to provide them. I will provide the questions, which in some cases may reveal the answers.
Here is a photo of the current back porch on the house Paul wrote about. I do not know if this is the back porch he described lifting- both are known to have been about as wide as the house, as this photo shows. But I offer the photo for an illustration, not claiming it is the same porch. I suspect the porch Paul mentions is the one shown on page 27 of Randy Strossen�s book, The Mightiest Minister. That porch, in 1955, appears to be far less sturdy and substantial than the photo here. Frankly I lack the skill to estimate the weight of either porch, but my off-handed guess is that neither would weigh three and a half tons. Anyone aware of construction lumber weights etc., feel free to provide input.
Questions:
A backlift platform should be no wider and no longer than is needed, so that balance and stability are increased, and the teetering is minimized. If the porch uprights seen in the photo are six feet apart, this porch may be 18 to 20 feet in length, which would make it the longest backlift �platform� in history. Perhaps it is about six feet wide/deep?The first problem Paul would have on his first ever backlift would be finding the east-west and north-south center balance points. I am guessing the porch skirting was not present when Paul saw the tool box under the porch , and that the tool box was probably not located at the perfect center balance point until Paul moved it into position.
So Paul moved the tool box to where he guessed the center balance point would be, raised up under the bottom of the porch and had his back pressing against what? Against floor joists! This was impromptu, and there is no mention of having a board ready to use, so his back was pressing against the joists which were how far apart? Standard 16� or wider 24�. If 16� then two joists would be putting more than 6,500 lbs of pressure on very specific rims directly on his back.
The other dilemma regards where the joists were located. That is, under ideal conditions, the center balance point would have been located midway between two joists and when he positioned himself, balance would be there, especially if the joists were 24� apart- otherwise, say if one joist ended up at the perfect balance point he would have it pressing directly on his spine, which would also mean only one joist was being pushed against as Paul�s bi-delt width would not have included another joist even if they were spaced at 16� centers (his shoulders were not 32� wide) and which I hope we can all agree would be impossible to balance. And of course, all this presupposes that he found the perfect balance point on his first attempt and did not tire himself by lifting one end only one or more times before finding the balance point. And of course it is very unlikely that he put his spine perpendicular to the joists.
Also, how high would the center of this lengthy porch have to be raised before the ends would also be raised off their supports- six inches, ten inches- and, how would Paul, with no witnesses be able to ascertain he in fact had cleared all supports? He could hardly glance fore and aft and left and right under more than three tons of pressure could he? Paul wrote Jan 24, 1990 to me regarding his backlifting, �If I could lift it an inch, I could lift it four inches, and that�s the way the 6,000+ pounds was moved.� Would four inches lifted up directly above his back provide enough range of motion to cause the far ends of the porch to leave their supports?
But the crucial question that any experienced lifter must ask himself is this: When you are trying a new lift for the very first time, and are not warmed up in that movement, do you believe the amount you could lift on that initial, unskilled, attempt would be greater than what you would be able to lift after an additional 12 to 18 months training? This is what we are being asked to believe: that Paul, having lifted the porch, later concluded, that his record backlift was in fact lighter than the back porch backlift. Why train then? Have you ever had to train to lift a lighter weight than you just lifted on a first ever try at that lift? Do not lighter weights come easier even without training?
And at what point in his training did Paul realize the back porch was heavier? If, using his numbers, that is: an 1,800 pound platform and a 3,500 pound safe were used as a starting point- which would total 5,300 pounds- surely that was noticed as lighter than the porch? Indeed it is 20% or so lighter. In fact, of course, we must alter the 3,500 pound safe down to its accurate weight of about 2,300 lbs, so his beginning backlift (if that�s what was employed) would have been 4,100 pounds- or 2,400 lbs lighter than the porch- a veritable warmup. Of course, I believe the weight of the platform must also be reduced to much less than 1,800 lbs, but the relevant point for this purpose has been made, I trust, that the beginning weights were so low that he surely would have made much more rapid progress since in fact if this story is accurate, he had ALREADY exceeded what he spend a year or more training for.
It is almost the reverse of Milo of Crotona�s training method �
Now, some of you may have read this far and thought that I should have read Paul�s biography and I would have known that my dates are way off. Actually, the biography cannot be accurate since it is not consistent with itself, when it offers, �By June 1957 [1957?] people had begun to ask�� about Cyr being in Guinness and Paul not. So Paul continues �I trained long and hard between exhibitions at weightlifting meets and in nightclubs�� for the backlift record attempt. Let�s examine this timeline.
Being as lenient as we can be, if people began asking about the Cyr entry on June 1, 1957, Paul would have had eleven days in which to spy the porch height, backlift the back porch, lift in exhibitions around the state or country, appear in nightclubs around the state or country, return to help his father build the backlift platform to be used, all the while somehow training long and hard. The longest he could have trained would be eleven days even if he had built the platform the same day as he tried the back porch backlift. And then surely he would have immediately known that his early poundages on the newly constructed platform were much lighter than the back porch backlift.
So the reference to June1957 cannot be accurate.
Posted by TheEditor @ 08:38 PM CST
9/10/2004: Fact Sheet of W.A. Pullum�s progress on the One Hand Clean and Bent Press
Friday, September 10, 2004
This week a fact sheet for your printer:
Some samples of W.A. Pullum�s progress on the One Hand Clean and Bent Press:
Oct 30, 1911 Right hand clean and bent press 163
Nov 30, 1911 Right hand clean and bent press 168
Jul 5, 1912 Left hand clean and bent press 161; right hand clean, 193.5
Dec 5, 1912 Left hand clean and bent press 166
Dec 5, 1912 Right hand clean and bent press 178.5Jan 27, 1913 Right hand clean and bent press 179.5
Mar 20, 1913 Right hand clean and bent press 180.75
Apr 10, 1913 Left hand clean and bent press 174.5
Mar 26, 1914 Right hand clean and bent press 183
Sep 17, 1914 Left hand clean and bent press 177
Mar 25, 1915 Right hand clean and bent press 188.5
Apr 28, 1915 Right hand clean and bent press 193
May 4, 1915 Right hand clean and bent press 196
On May 24, 1915 he became a pro, having in the previous four years: 14 championships, 50 gold medals, and had broken close to 200 official world�s and British WL records in all classes from 9 stone to heavyweight.
Posted by TheEditor @ 06:13 AM CST
9/3/2004: Letter from Charles A. Smith New Year�s Day 1987 to Joe Roark
Friday, September 3, 2004
Thanks for yours of December 26th, reaching me on the 29th. Hope you and your family all had a good Holiday. I spent the day over at Vera�s [his daughter] and had a great time watching the boys drive their sister up every wall in the house. Had an old English dinner- roast beef, roast potatoes cooked along with the beef, brussels sprouts, Yorkshire pudding, creamed onions and some lovely gravy to pout over the Yorkshire pudding.
Well, here we are, starting a New Year and I doubt if the miserable world we live in will be any better. More than likely worse than it already is.
Not too much news to report from this end. The Todds are away south visiting George Weaver, then across Florida to her parent-mother, then up to NYC and possibly York. I have had the odd card from them but little else except the usual having a good time and no �wish you were here�.
Good to hear Meg has been accepted at the U of I business school. If and when she does get her degree, as I am sure she will, it will be worth every cent it costs her of your hard earned cash to go on and get her graduate degree, since BBA�s are a dime a dozen these days, while the MBA is THE trade union ticket to whatever fame and fortune is left after the Ivan Boeskys have grabbed what there is around.
[Roark: Meg now has a double Masters]Most of the feedback I have been getting re IM has been very negative and from friends of Fred XXX�s ilk- more of that worthy later- and, of course, these are the sort who would bitch anyway and merely because change has been made, and not because of the good or harm that had resulted from that change. One complaint is that the mags are too �Weiderized�. The positive side is that the type size is much better for reading.
Had a nice letter from John Dawe who mentioned you had written and that he had said- or else suggested- that the date given by Leo Gaudreau could be relied upon. I think this is about right. Leo, despite the running feud he had going with Willoughby, did fairly good research and, more important to me- has a much more friendly and compassionate nature and, more to my liking, I have never known him to do a mean or spiteful action. He has always been honest in all the connections I have had with him.
I have a feeling- getting back to IM- that it will SLOWLY improve and become more to my liking, and thereby gain the acceptance of the �Old Timers�. Balik assured me- for what his assurances are worth- that he was interested in the roots of the sport and intended to continue with an occasional article by David Webster. Again, we shall see. In my opinion- and for what that�s worth- few people seem to realize that the market is, and should be slanted to the young in the Game and those entering it. There�s where the money is to be made, if money making is what you are interested in. I think you SHOULD WRITE for IM and perhaps the best way to start would be by submitting that article about measurements that you passed over to the Flushing Flash, he hasn�t paid you or hasn�t used yet. Both the articles I have written for Balik were paid for promptly- AS PROMISED- so he realizes that here is one way he can get the better of the Woodland Hills Wonder who sometimes �forgets� to pay, and one has to dun him for moths- as I did with the last article I wrote for him.
Balik feels that powerlifting and Olympic Lifting are already covered well in other publications and thus, as he sees it, it would be a waste of space and repetitive to do as these specialized mags do. He will have an occasional article in the mag- I understand Glossbrenner is preparing one on Paul Anderson- and sometimes a profile on a prominent powerlifter- but that�s about it.
I am getting more and more disillusioned with Fred XXX. His latest letters to me have been full of racial slurs and bigoted remarks and reading them one would think that all �Niggers and Ricans� as he calls blacks and Hispanics were all drug users, criminals, lazy, won�t work, crooks, wife beaters and general nuisances who are unable to keep themselves or their homes clean. It is obvious he has done little or no reading, study or what have you academe, and as little traveling. Because a �Rican� broke into Walter Good�s place, he now thinks that one will break in and stab him. In another letter, after I had written to him, telling him to stop his bitching about the new IM and support it, he wrote back suggesting that my opinion was colored by the money Balik was paying me for the articles I had written.
Your assessment of Fred re Hise may be on the target. I recall in a letter to me I had said that either you or I could write the definitive article about Hise. His reply was �I�ve already done that�. More evidence of a mind totally shut up. One could do a terrific article on the anti negro and anti Semitic aspects of Hise- he called New York JEW YORK. Fred mentions Hise telling him about when he was in a hobo jungle. Fred had seen Hise carrying two small cannon around his guts and had been told by Hise that he had been attacked by three �Niggers� in a jungle and had presented the cannons to the �niggers�. When Hise told me this story in a letter dated 1938, it was five �niggers�.
Fred doesn�t know shit from clay when it comes to Hise lore. I have known Hise since before Fred was born, had scores of letters from him, although, in all fairness I knew little of his private or family life. That he was honest in his beliefs, there is no doubt. That he was one of the unsung heroes of weight training is true. But a human being has many sides to his character and make up and Fred didn�t see one tenth of them, even though he did meet Hise a time or two.
I am wondering why Hinbern is so interested in Jowett. He knows the score so far as Jowett is concerned- his flimflamming and deceit. Gaudreau thinks George F less than the dust.
Came across some fascinating stuff just before the Todds left for the Holidays. Some letters from Liedermann to Ottley. These concerned a womens bodybuilding contest IN 1922! That Macfadden was putting on. Called it the $1000 dollar contest. Turns out that the first prize was 300, second 200 and third 100. The rest- 400 went , so Macfadden told thegirls, toward their �expenses�.
However Liederamnn entered his wife whom he personally dubbed MISS ALASKA into the contest. She came from Minnesota and the only connection she had had with Alaska was when she purchased a can of salmon in a delicatessen.
So Liederman waltzes over to see Mac and his head gofer and arranges for Miss Alaska to win. Mac didn�t care so long as the patrons poured pelf into his pockets. Came time for the �Preliminary judging� and Miss Alaska promptly appears for it.
That night, ensconced with Earle in their connubial couch, she pours out a tale of dastardly doings to the effect that when the prelims came, up, well, what do you know, all the girls had to appear IN PRIVATE WITH MAC and a couple of his friends STARK NAKED. Mac explains that this was required in order to see the girls were �all in good health� and what they had by way of equipment was �all their own�. To heap on further insult, he had peep holes in the curtains surrounding the �prelim judging� so his cronies could get a private showing.
Earle is furious and goes over the next morning and asks Mac if he�d like his head handed to him on a platter a la John the Baptist, with Earle playing the part of Salome. Needless to say �Miss Alaska� didn�t win the contest.
Happy new year to you and yours,
Chas.Posted by TheEditor @ 06:43 AM CST
