Joe Roark's IronHistoryArchives.com
The HUGE library of Iron History compiled by Joe Roark.
Welcome to Iron History with Joe Roark!
Joe Roark has been studying the iron game since 1957, and by 1970 began a systematic gathering of information on index cards. By the time his first computer was acquired, there were several hundred thousand references to be typed into it.
For a few years he published his own newsletter called MuscleSearch: The Roark Report. By 1992 he was appointed as the IFBB Men's Bodybuilding Historian, and began writing about history for FLEX in his column Factoids. For ten years he contributed to Iron Game History from the U of Texas at Austin. Recently he also began writing All Our Yesterdays for FLEX.
His passion has always been the period between 1880 and 1920, with particular emphasis on the oldtime strongmen of that era. Joe will be offering bits of history for Cyberpump once per week, and the text will be relevant to the dates of the calendar for those events of yesteryear relevant to the coming week.
In this column, readers will also be able to ask Joe questions or comment on his posts. Note: The comments are solely for interaction between Joe and the readers only -- not reader to reader.
Ironhistory Jan 30, 2004 by Joe Roark
Thursday, January 29, 2004
I have been busier than usual lately trying to catch up after my computer problems, and my upcoming distractions, so this week a little leisure for you friendly provider as we take a casual look at Jan 30th
In February we will be starting segments of the John Grimek file as regards Strength & Health magazine. It contains approximately 1,200 lines of references. Muscular Development will follow, and later the other mag refs to John�s participation in this fine finagled physique mess we all so love. Interspersed will be other material, so if you have not re-upped your subscription at $12 per year you may want to consider that. Believe me, if someone would have offered me this Grimek material I would have paid far more than $12 for it alone, and gone away skipping and whistling!
As usual you are reminded of the free forums at ironhistory.com. Be kind to yourself and follow the registration demands that some say makes a fortnight naked in Siberia seem easy. That is, use your real first name- then leave a space- then use your real last name. Any other method is highly recommended IF you do NOT really want in. We are having some fun there and we have several people posting who are very savvy. Hope you join us!
Beauty/BeastJanuary 30, 1966. He was busy posing to win his third bodybuilding contest; she was busy being born.
He, even these 38 years later is known for his mass and brutal power and dominant presence; she could dominate any man she chooses by a tilt of that lovely head and a wink.
His battles including facing the tornado from Austria; she faced other beautiful women in the only wars that have appeal.
Sergio Oliva won Mr. Chicagoland that day; Amy Fadhli won a lifetime of rare beauty.
Here are some other happenings from Jan 30 through the years:
1884 Charles O. Breed did 6 one arm jerks with 201 pounds
1897 The St. Petersburg Athletic Club was founded
1904 Hackenschmidt defeated the wrestler Madrali
1930 Ron Ledas was born
1938 LeRoy/LeeRoy Saba was born
1941 Joe Bednarski was born
1941 Vancouver City WL chps
1941 Ozark AAU WL chps
1949 The Swedish National Weightlifting Chps in Stockholm
1954 Paul Waldham won the Open Novice Physique in Philadelphia
1955 Bill Holland won Jr. Mr. Cleveland
1960 Robert Merenda won Mr. Camden County
1960 John Hazel won the inaugural Mr. Niagara Peninsula Miss:Edna MacVicar
1960 San Diego City & County Powerlifting chps; bench, curl, squat
1964 Bill Myles was born
1965 Tuny Monday won Mr. Central State
1965 Oklahoma State Powerlifting chps in Tulsa
1965 Von Lamon won Mr. Bay Area
1967 Trish Swandler was born
1968 Bill Hilton placed 3rd in his 3rd contest, Mr. Sunshine State
1971 At 6th annual Mr. Denver. John Schoechl won
1971 Mr. Novice California: Gordon Myer
1971 Mr. Camder YMCA: Primivito Peredo
1982 Mr. Lynchburg: Hugh Huggins Ms: Amitee Baramore
1987 Someone claimed an overhead, one hand lift of 7,063 pounds
1988 Carol Appling won the Challenge Cup
2001 Paul Borresen diedand on Jan 30, 1991 a press conference happened at the Plaza Hotel in New York City, to announce the World Bodybuilding Federation (WBF) formed by a body slam of an idea in the mind of McMahon. The 13 men signed proved to uphold the superstitious in their wariness. Eventually the WBF held only two contests- each a world level, each won by Gary Strydom, and each demonstrating why prepaid bodybuilders tend to become as lazy as the rest of us when we are prepaid. Arnold had the message, �Stay Hungry�. Eventually some of the bare backed wanderers came nap sacking home to the IFBB, growled about fines imposed, and hopes deposed, and rejoined the only game in town.
I will be in and out for the next several days, so if I do not respond to your email- it is because I have not seen it.
Meanwhile, I can usually be found unshaven and haggard at ironhistory.com forums, where by the way, we have a contest going on to name our logo.
Posted by TheEditor @ 07:08 PM CST
Ironhistory Jan 23, 2004 by Joe Roark
Thursday, January 22, 2004
Note: I lost about six days this past week because my computer got Mad Cow or somesuch. I am working on the John Grimek file for February�s columns, and we will begin by serializing the Strength & Health connection, then later the Muscular Development, then later the other various magazines. It will take months to offer it all in Friday installments, but it will be a part of the oppressive, cruel, how can we sleep at night charge of $12 per year.
Bill and I are discussing how to make an ebook out of it and for a corresponding how can we sleep at night charge, you may be able to access the whole file, or the parts mentioned above separately immediately if you need the info quickly, or are not expecting to live much longer, or want to find the errors to embarrass me- whatever your reason may be�
More on that later.
Letter from Charles A. Smith to Joe Roark June 18, 1986
Dear Joe, At this moment you must be winging your way in the wild blue yonder to [Arthur] Jones� place. Hope you enjoy the trip and I certainly would be interested in learning what went on and your impressions.
I am not at all surprised that the new Brooklyn Flash mag doesn�t contain your article. He and XXX are tarred with the same brush. Why any man has to act this way, why he cannot keep a promise made is beyond me. It seems to me that they get their kicks out of shafting people- thinking I guess that it proves their superiority. Whereas it only shows what a monumental inferiority complex they have,
There is one guy who might know about the late Sandwina and that is Sig Klein. Latest word on him is that he is now eating, had gained back some weight and is even taking workouts. But there is some mystery here and someone should try to solve it. The first words of the Todds when I found the cutting and pointed it out to them was that it was an error made by the newspaper. I pointed out that in the case of an obit, the info was delivered by friends and close family members and they were pretty certain to make sure the right info was given. Then the Todds heard from you [unclear] tracing the same info from VARIETY, almost always an impeccable source. There are several possibilities re the name NOCK and we do know now that the name SANDWINA was taken from the circus both her �parents� ran. So, power to your arm.
Re the Glossbrenner deal I will say again and again that it was a POOR piece of reporting in that it was misleading. All the newcomers will believe that all the presses were the same and performed under the same conditions. It�s just like that 400 one arm press five reps by Venus. In the future you are gonna find some people who will NOT MENTION it as done on a machine but will think it was an actual one arm press of some kind performed with a barbell The judges and refs may have been poor in their decisions, but that has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE FACT THAT Glossbrenner failed to footnote the fact that there had been style changes and by not doing so he has created the impression that the lifts are ALL IDENTICAL. To my way of thinking a tremendous article could have been written on the DECLINE AND FALL OF THE PRESS and THEN USING THE TABLES OF RECORDS. So far as I am concerned, the article- if one can call it that- was a misleading one.
I agree hat the last issue of IRON MAN was pitiful. He had two authors who each had three articles apiece in the mag. This is bad. It seemed to me that it was---just thrown together. He appears to have lost all interest in the mag. That�s what old age does for you Joe, it takes away your youth, your joys, your �All you have� and pays you back with death and dust.
As for the judges not noting the changes in the press officially- that is WRONG. The changes in the press were AGREED TO AT COMMITTEE MEETINGS. The trouble lies in the fact that certain committee members allowed the sport to become a political instrument.
There are people who were not present during Julius Caesar�s campaign in Gaul or at the Punic Wars, but they are still accepted as experts TODAY on those events. How many people know that Abraham Lincoln contracted syphilis, gave it to his wife and son? Hardly. Tell anyone and they look at you as if you are nuts. How many people have the idea that Henry the 8th died of complications of the same disease? He didn�t. He died from complications of diabetes. So what we learn from history is that we don�t learn from history.
Most of the poor decisions rendered by the judges were so rendered when a member of their club or team or country were lifting before them. It wasn�t because they didn�t know the rules. They HAD TO since they all had to pass tests. It was partiality entering into the deal.
Why did I give XXX the silent treatment? This is a long story and the telling of it would do no good now. Suffice to say that I ALWAYS treated him as a gentleman and in completely friendly fashion. He LIED about me to Weider, a total and unnecessary lie, blaming me for something HE was doing against Joe- among other things like finding out he was paying other people more than twice what he was paying me and for less work than I was doing. I don�t forget, nor do I forgive a dirty turn. Maybe wrong on my part, but I am as I am and make no excuses for it.
I am in a bit of a quandary about my old timers� dinner articles. Since I sent it more than a month ago, I have heard nothing from Rader whereas he ALWAYS replies to say he has received the stuff with a check. I also understand that Ken Rosa has also sent in an article about the dinner, so maybe he is trying to make up his mind as to whose article to use. But he did write me asking me to cover the bash for him.
Louise Davis. A very nice girl and quite attractive. She and John Davis last lived at an address on St. Marks Place in Brooklyn. Then I was told many years later that Louise was a real estate salesman. There is also the added difficulty that she may have married again, although I don�t think so. So one avenue to pursue would be the Brooklyn REAL ESTATE LICENSED BROKERS AND REALTORS. You might be able to get this via your University�s school of economics or info from this school. At least they should be able to shove you in the right direction.
I can tell you why Johnnie left all his classical music recording to Pete George. Both he and Pete, as I was, were into classical music. Pete�s interest was orchestral, Davis was in vocal. He had quite a good basso baritone voice. There was an occasion when the [WL] team was in one of the Scandinavian countries when he and Pete George went to some record company and had their voices recorded singing a duet and another recording with them singing separately. I know, Davis played them to me at his home when my wife and I were visiting him as we often did.
This last two weeks I have been going through some of the most fascinating stuff I have ever waded through at the [Todd-McLean] Collection. It consists of a stack of letters between [George] Jowett and [Ottley] Coulter fifteen inches high. The letters start in early 1922 and now, one third through the batch we have reached 1927.
All sorts of goodie gossip emerged- or should I say have emerged. For one thing it is very doubtful if Jowett was in the country legally. And there is no doubt that he was quite a flim flam artist. He was always onto Ottley asking him to get this or that or send this or that or write this or that FOR HIM. He also wasn�t living with his wife, leaving her up in Canada while he was working for Redmond and STRENGTH MAG in Philly.
On one occasion he had bought a new car but hadn�t insured it. He had gone to Atlantic City to see Liederman and six miles out of town on the way back to Philly had been totaled. He happened to have a young lady in the car with him.
On another occasion he wrote to Ottley from NYC where he was working for the Breitbart Institute- run by a guy named Engels- and wrote Ottley to dash off two books about �How I Built My Neck� by Hackenschmidt and �How I Built My Chest� by George Lurich�When Ottley complained that both these men were active at the time and might object Jowett wrote back �You write the books and leave the legalities to me�.
He was fired from STRENGTH without a moments notice. Redmond walking into his office and saying �Jowett, you are finished.� When Ottley asked for details, these did not come forth.
I have been told�that XXX was complaining long, loud and bitterly about how much one of his mags was costing to put out. Someone did a spot audit and found out he was CHARGING HIS HAIR TRANSPLANTS TO THE COMPANY.
Best of everything to you and yours,
ChasIf you have not signed up for the ironhistory.com forums, please consider doing so.
See you Jan 30!
Posted by TheEditor @ 07:48 PM CST
Iron History Jan 16, 2004 by Joe Roark
Thursday, January 15, 2004
(To ironhistory.com readers: my computer is making more strange, unexpected moves than than a fitness competitor in mid-routine, but rather than miss my deadline I am submitting this. Please excuse any errors- sometimes when I hit a key the character does not appear on the screen- I have tried to catch all the mistakes, but who knows?)
Here is a list of the bodybuilders who have been featured in Flex magazine's recurring Big Picture feature- now called The Real Big Picture, which are fact filled pages about the various, mostly modern bodybuilders. This column began in March 1993, so here is the first decade plus.
This list is complete through the February 2004 issue, and is presented with date of birth, name of subject, and issue in which the person is featured. The software we use for this column does not support columns, so pardon the jagged edges!
List is alphabetical by last name. Females are in UPPER CASE:
Apr 21, 1969 Tevita Aholelei Feb 2001
Jul 02, 1961 Achim Albrecht Apr 1994
Sep 26, 1966 Troy Alves Jul 2002
Nov 13, 1972 Melvin Anthony Oct 1999
Feb 21, 1972 Jason Arntz Apr 2000
Aug 29, 1959 Flavio Baccianini Jul 1994
Nov 11, 1955 Samir Bannout Jul 1996
Nov 25, 1971 Fred Bigot Feb 2002
Jul 09, 1976 MANDY BLANK Apr 2000
Oct 26, 1970 MONICA BRANT Jun 2002
Feb 01,1964 SHARON BRUNEAU Oct 1993
Mar 18, 1963 Orville Burke Jan 2001
n/a 'Captain Anabolic' (drawing) Mar 1997
Jul 22, 1968 Darrem Charles Aug 1999
Apr 23, 1968 KIM CHIZEVSKY Oct 1997
Dec 01, 1965 Bob Cicherillo Jun 2001
Oct 27, 1962 Charles Clairmonte Aug 1996
Jun 18, 1969? MELISSA COATES Jun 1999
Aug 18, 1946 Boyer Coe Aug 1994
May 13, 1964 Ronnie Coleman Apr 1998, Jul 2003
Aug 19, 1967 Chris Cormier May 1996
Aug 30, 1961 Porter Cottrell Jan 1997
Jan 25, 1959 LAURA CREAVALLE Dec 1994, Feb 1999
Nov 22, 1972 SUSIE CURRY Sep 2001
Aug 03, 1973 Jay Cutler Sep 1998, May 2003
Apr 10, 1965 J.D. Dawodu Aug 2001
Sep 12, 1967 Paul DeMayo Jan 1994
Jul 21, 1951 DIANA DENNIS Dec 1993
Apr 12, 1966 Paul Dillett Nov 1996
Jul 15, 1969 Garrett Downing Oct 2000
Apr 16, 1942 Dave Drape Mar 1999
Dec 22, 1960 Chris Duffy Jul 1993
Jan 04, 1959 CORY EVERSON Feb 1994
Nov 09, 1951 Lou Ferrigno Feb 1998
Feb 15, 1955 BEV FRANCIS Sep 1994
Mar 04, 1965 Mike Francois Apr 1996
May 16, 1963 Rich Gaspari Jun 2003
Sep 25, 1962 VICKIE GATES Nov 1998
Jun 24, 1962 Claude Groulx May 2002
Mar 05, 1962? Alq Gurley Sep 1999
Nov 11, 1959 Lee Haney Mar 1994, Nov 2002
Jan 03, 1969 Ian Harrison Oct 1996
Dec 02, 1976 BETH HORN Mar 2002
Nov 25, 1969 Dexter Jackson May 2000
May 31, 1969 Dennis James Nov 1999
Jan 02, 1971 LENA JOHANNESEN Feb 2000
Feb 25, 1961 Kenny Jones Apr 1999
Mar 29, 1972 Shari Kamali Mar 2001
Mar 30, 1968 Roland Kickinger Jan 1998
Mar 08, 1960 Lee Labrada Jun 1993
Jul 16, 1966 Kevin Levrone May 1993, May 1999, Dec 2003
Oct 18, 1966 Don Long May 1997
May 05, 1973 KIM LYONS Aug 2002
Nov 05, 1970 Aaron Maddron Dec 1999
Oct 02, 1974 TIMEA MARJOROVA Dec 2000
Mar 29, 1960 J.J. Marsh Sep 1993
Jul 29, 1973 Victor Martinez Dec 2001
Nov 08, 1965 Mike Matarazzo Sep 1996, Oct 2003
Feb 22, 1962 LENDA MURRAY Aug 1993
Feb 17, 1968 David Palumbo Jul 1999
Jan 11, 1957 Tony Pearson May 1994
Jul 06, 1972 Lee Priest Jun 1998
Oct 26, 1968 Tom Prince Mar 1998
Feb 02, 1960 Jim Quinn Oct 1994
Nov 18, 1961 Mike Quinn Nov 1994
Sep 09, 1965 Shawn Ray Apr 1993, Aug 1997, Jan 2003
1965? Victor Richards Nov 1993
Sep 22, 1964 Eddie Robinson Dec 1998
May 24, 1946 Robby Robinson Jan 1995
Feb 22, 1972 Markus Ruhl Sep 2000
Aug 07, 1962 DENISE RUTKOWSKI Jun 1994
Jul 10, 1972 KELLY RYAN Jan 2002
Jan 17, 1964 Milos Sarcev Jun 1996
Feb 02, 1970 Gunter Schlierkamp Aug 1998, Jan 2004
May 08, 1970 Ernie Taylor Jul 1998
Jul 12, 1969 Quincy Taylor Apr 2002
Aug 25, 1956 Vince Taylor May 1998
May 13 or 30, 1974 Tommi Thorvildsen Oct 2001
Jan 14, 1967 Craig Titus Aug 2000
Mar 01, 1972 LAURIE VANIMAN Oct 2002
Nov 20, 1971 Marvin Ward Sep 2002
Aug 23, 1965 Flex Wheeler Apr 1997
May 06, 1977 JENNY WORTH Jul 2001
Apr 19, 1962 Dorian Yates Mar 1993, Sep 1997, Dec 2002
Dec 14, 1972 MARY YOCKEY Jun 2000
Jun 28, 1942 Frank Zane May 2001
Jul 09, 1962 Troy Zuccolotto Feb 19952004 upcoming:
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DecemberPosted by TheEditor @ 08:13 PM CST
Jan 9, 2004 Iron History
Thursday, January 8, 2004
Letter from Charles A. Smith to Joe Roark June 6, 1986
Dear Joe, Thanks for your letter post dated June 2nd, which arrived on June 4th, and for the news letter which arrived on June 5th. The latter I think was one of the best- if not THE best- you he so far issued. The only change I suggest- note I did not say fault or criticism- is that you, in future issues the last five pages [sic]. If the report had been all that was contained in the first five- that is of the same kind of material, you'd have a real winner, and the sort of stuff that would have readers coming back for more.
Thanks for returning the Jowett birth certificate. You didn't say if you had Xeroxed it, but I assume you did. Thanks also for the bit on Kati Sandwina. The plot thickens as they say on stage. No, Jan [Todd] didn't tell me she had received it until I asked her if she had heard from you lately. Then she mentioned the Kati bit. I had, as you may remember, found the obit cut from some newspaper by Ottley and handed it to her, giving out my thoughts on the matter of NOCK. Jan at first dismissed them saying it was a 'newspaper' error- some sort of misquote I guess- but my reply was to the effect that such info was usually obtained from direct family members who in cases of obits are always careful to get what they wanted into the notice to appear in the press.
I sent an account of the Old Timers' Bash to Rader who told me he wanted me to cover it and I did and sent it off and I haven't heard anything in reply. Since it was an Old Timers' Bash I wrote about the Old Timers and what we discussed about them with a bit of would be humor heaved in here and there. Also have another article ready to go concerning the lies and bullshit that appear in certain mags.
I note your remarks about Glossbrenner. But I suggest you think it through a little more deeply. True there is a fine list of press records but it is not only deceptive but MISLEADING. I know it isn't intentional on Glossbrenner's part and frankly I don't see what pole vaulting has to do with weightlifting. Glass fiber vaulting poles are the problems of Track and Field and not ones for weightlifting committees.
As I say Glossbrenner's list of world's 'Press' records was misleading in that the presses at the top of the list, in the earlier years had little or no resemblance to those at the bottom of the list. In fact the presses as done by the Russians and others WERE NOT PRESSES AT ALL but PUSH JERKS.
The last contest in which GOOD presses were performed was the 1936 Olympics when the Military Press rules were stuck to, feet together, toes turned out at 45 degree angle and the weight pressed from the shoulders with NO back bend whatsoever. The judges having no guts to rule correctly had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT since by the time those tremendous poundages were being put overhead were so VASTLY different from the presses of the 1936 Olympics that they resemble them as much as a cat fish looks like a cougar. They were bending forward, bending knees, leaning back so far they got splinters in the tops of their heads from scraping the platform. They were using the knee bend to start the weight off with a jerk. In fact those lifts didn't even resemble the old British Two Hands Clean and Push in which you WERE allowed to lean forward and back as much as you wanted but WERE NOT allowed to unlock the knees or jerk the weight from the shoulders.
So the danger is that some impressionable kids will really believe that pressing records made incredible leaps due to improved training and 'Trainers Of The Champions since 1036[sic]".
To have been accurate Glossbrenner should have written a complete article and explained just when changes in pressing rules and techniques took place. Frinstance when I was reffing and judging the only difference between the two hand presses of the 30's and the fifties was that you were allowed to keep the feet apart. Then it gradually got worse and worse. Give'em an inch and they take a yard. As I see it, it is UNFAIR to class the presses of the Russians who made the last press records before they heaved the lift out, with the presses of the thirties, forties, and fifties. Those latter presses weren't presses at all but Two Hands somehow lifts.
The real trouble lies in the fact that SPORT has been allowed to become an open instrument of POLITICS and instead of the refs and two judges being the sole arbiters, there was allowed to come into existence a 'Jury of Appeal' - POLITICAL of course.
So Glossbrenner may have done a fine job of research but not a FACTUAL ONE since he merely quoted records. The job of the HISTORIAN and the Statistician is not to say just what happened but WHY AND HOW. And what the hell pole vaulting has got to do with the Olympic Lifts I can't see.
The BOTTOM LINE OF RESPONSIBILITY LIES NOT WITH THE JUDGES BUT WITH THOSE WHO ARE THE HISTORIANS OF THE GAME- THEIR JOB BEING TO TELL IT AS IT WAS AND IS AND NOT TO OMIT VITAL INFORMATION�.THIS IS WHERE THE DANGER LIES. In inaccurate or INCOMPLETE reporting. No one wants to believe that Sandow was anything but a little tin god whereas in fact he was a BASTARD, an arrogant, selfish egomaniac. But try to tell that to those who have been fed Sandow pap since he passed away.
True he did a little good- in fact a great deal of good for Physical Culture, but look at those marvelous autobanns [sic] Hitler built and didn't Mussolini make the trains run on time?
Enough.
Thanks for the info on Hoffie. I think I have seen the gal you mentioned. She was a little above average height- around 5'7" or so, with large dark eyes and as straight up and down as an out house door. Hoffie was always appearing with her in the NYC area at shows. The York bunch referred to her as 'Bob's girl'.
[Roark note: referring to the Olde Timers' Dinner] No. I didn't speak much to XXX. He came up and said, 'Do you remember me' and I replied 'Yes, I remember you' and just sat there looking at him. He stood there for a while and then walked away seeing I wanted NOTHING to do with him or say anything else- the BASTARD.
Vic Boff told me some time ago that he [the bodybuilder, not Vic] was having wife problems, that the missus was the real brains behind the business�
[Roark note: this was a man whom Charles never forgave for some injustice which Charles would never share with me- so I have no clue why, though I do know who- a very famous bodybuilder]
As for XXX I was not only shocked but very bitter that he didn't come up and talk to me. He saw me- he could hardly have done otherwise since my name was announced by Murdock the Mighty as speaker. I saw him looking at me so he can't say he didn't know I was there. I never forget treatment like this and my memory is long. I have never harmed him in any way and did much to help him when he was- mostly through his own fault- tossed out of the AAU as a professional. And I must say unfairly so since he had done nothing that the York bunch hadn't been doing for YEARS. One ALWAYS sticks to a friend, and this he DIDN'T DO.
Well, I'd better hang up. Hope you enjoy your trip and I do hope you get a chance to talk to someone at Nautilus and let them know how I feel.
The best of everything to you and yours.
Chas.Posted by TheEditor @ 08:19 PM CST
